Re: Irish Virus

[Steve]

I wasn't going to reply but I have to. I do find that joke really offensive. Hey ho back to the 70s and "The Comedians"

[michele cryer]

eek, sorry Steve, would you like me to delete those which you find offensive?

[Mitch]

Steve,

Any chance of an apology too from someone called Steve who posted this joke below on enrager recently.
I posted this quote below a couple of days ago in the crap jokes section cause I found it offensive and wanted an explanation on why someone called 'Steve' put this on enrager? If it's another Steve then sincere apologies. I agree with your comments to Michele - but I see double standards here sweetie. Await your reply with interest??


"What's the difference between an anarcha-feminist and the rubbish??
The rubbish gets taken out once a week.

Umm, someone, can't think who posted this on enrager sometime back!! Apparently came from Freedom - f u c k i n great!!!!!!!! guessed reet, I do find this offensive.

I rather enjoy perusing enrager - but have hesitated in joining and contributing as it's coming across to me as, urr, a little boy anarchist sparring 'wit twit' forum with some pretty nasty personal comments and urrr not many postings of action. Still, I'm sure you're all getting off on it boys!

Lucy82's postings however are of great interest and will no doubt pull me in soon.

www.enrager.net/forums/index.php"

[Steve]

The joke posted on enrager was by someone called "Alan_is_f**king_Dead" thread www.enrager.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2848
I replied.

f**king hell we've just gone back in time to the 1970s and "The Comedians" TV show or did you watch "Carry on Girls" the other night?

I don't go in for double standards.

I also post a lot less on enrager because I find it really juvinile and some of the posters there think it's all right to make offensive remarks because they think they're being 'ironic'. I disagree and have been accussed of being 'too PC' because I think the use of language is important. Also many of the threads get diverted by people making 'in jokes'.

[Mitch]

Hey up, it's your week for apologies - hope you'll accept mine too.

I agree with your comments on enrager - it is painfully disappointing to come finally to anarchism, and to find so many contradictions - especially on the ridcule of womens oppression and feminism as seen on enrager. And to have built a momentum locally, to find that anarchists are falling away.

Well, well, I continue on my learning curve - I've no intention of falling away. Seems to me anarcho-syndicalism without feminism is as ridiculous as feminism without anarcho-syndicalism. Much more to learn as always.

Have you any ideas on how enrager could progress from it's current stupidity? There is plenty on there which keeps me very interested - as previously stated with Lucy82, and Octoberlost starts some very interesting debates but they keep ending up in personal attacks and 'wit twit' stuff. Why don't Solfed start a webforum?

[Steve]

No problem, apologie(s) accepted.

It's amazing how much we seem to be sliding back in certain areas. No-one will make jokes about blacks or Asians anymore, at least not publicly but jokes about women and use of the word ‘gay’ as an insult are becoming more widespread. I could go on and maybe it’s something we need to have a proper discussion about.

As for feminism/anarcho-syndicalism I think you’re half right. For me feminism is about equality between women and men and must be (and is) part of anarcho-syndicalist thinking. However there are some strands of feminism that seek equality between the sexes within the present system, which I think is unworkable, and argue for more women in positions of power. Personally if my boss/manager is a woman I treat her same as I treat a man. I dislike policewomen as much as policemen and, to quote Bill Hicks, "People ask me what I think about that woman priest thing, you know. What, a woman priest? Women priests. Great, great. Now there's priests of both sexes I don't listen to."

The class analysis has to be the main one. It is working class women who suffer the most under capitalism but we cannot go down the road of a crude class-struggle approach that marginalises the women’s struggle.

[Mitch]

Now then, if you had been noting my postings in the anarcho-feminist thread (particularly my current inspiration from the activities of Mujeres Libres) you would know that we are thinking along exactly the same lines on this subject.

There can be no freedom for women without a changed system - and I despise feminism aka separatist which seeks to replace one dominant approach with another and works within capitalism, and I have no time for a feminist approach which has no comprehension of class difference and experience.

I have learnt all this not just through reading, but through bitter experience of clashings with my middle class sisters - many of whom are on cloud cuckoo land as regards what's really going on within our working class communities, and the experience of working class women in the everyday. I have clashed as well with some of my socialist feminist sisters who miss things in their obsession with movements. That one has been particularly painful. I say to them - there is pain in them there silences sisters!! You have much to learn from me and my working class sisters because frankly you are lost, have sold us out and are bitting the capitalist carrot.

When me and my working class sisters realise our own worth and capabilities we become rather dangerous - watch and see. I often feel much more affiliation with my own class, working class than I do my middle class sisters. But then I also have to face men in my own class who dismiss me and my working class sisters!

best Mitch

PS. can we continue this thread/debate if there's interest in anarcho feminist section.