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Post by Mitch on Jun 22, 2005 9:28:46 GMT
Michele writes: "As almost everyone knows, rape is not about sex particularly, rather it is about power..." I know there is some research that supports this, but is it research in this country or the USA? I'm worried about generalising on research done in this country and then extending it to other cultures. Generalisations, which I do & we all do, are a bit dangerous. I know in that book 'The Rai Quartet' there was a gang rape in a garden, I think by Indians, and an homosexual rape by the policeman Merrick of an Indian prisoner. But I'm not sure what this tells us about the culture of the Indian sub-continent or about rape. We all know what sex is (now there's a another generalisation!), well I think we all know, but 'power' is not an easy concept to define. Nobody seems to have solved the puzzle of satifactorily describing 'power' & who has the power in society. The Marxists stuggle with it, the sociologists struggle with it, Leo Tolstoy, who I do respect, deals with it in the epilogue to his book 'War & Peace', but even his attempt, I think, ends in failure. The student leader in the Indian article on sex violence calls for more police & cameras on campus. That would be troubling solution for anarchists to take. The rapist of thg young girl in Mumbai was a policeman. It surprises me how they manage to perform something like a gang rape. Erections are not automatically achieved by act of will and sometimes are achieve when you least want them. We know from Shakespeare and experience that alcohol is no aid to men in this matter: it amy spark up women, as Shakespeare says, but it has dampening effect on men. Wanting a p i s s can put anyone off. It must have something to do with the violence that arouses them and keeps them going. But I see the kidnappers in Delhi, dropped the violated girl off outside the headquarters of the Delhi Polices' Crime Against Women Cell. Now that seems strange: why did they go to the trouble and run the extra risk of getting caught? LISTEN 'ERE BARMY, THIS IS A SERIOUS THREAD ABOUT DEVELOPING POLICAL CONSCIOUSNESS, NOT SOME SPACE WHERE YOU CAN JERK OFF!! AND WORK YOURSELF UP TO EJACULATION. GET THE HELL OUT OF 'ERE, AND GO PLAY WITH YA GOAT, OR I'LL BLOODY BUST YA BALLS AND EAT UM FOR BREAKFAST. WOT THE FUCK ARE YOU GOING ON ABOUT ANYWAY - YOU IDIOT!!
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Post by bryan on Jun 24, 2005 5:00:44 GMT
My mate Mitch writes: "THIS IS A SERIOUS THREAD ABOUT DEVELOPING POLICAL CONSCIOUSNESS, NOT SOME SPACE WHERE YOU CAN JERK OFF!! AND WORK YOURSELF UP TO EJACULATION."
One of the delights of old age is that one is liberated from passtimes such as these.
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Post by bryan on Jun 24, 2005 5:38:56 GMT
PAKISTAN'S VICTIMS.
Next month, Pakistan's Prime Minister, Pervez Musharraf, visits George Bush in Washington.
Nicholas Kristof, in the International Herald Tribune, suggests Bush should call for the return of Mukhtaran Bibi's passport. Ms Bibi is a rape victim turned human-rights campaigner in Pakistan.
A few days ago Musharraf was battered with queries about why he persecuted rape victims & had to cancel interviews, when he visited New Zealand.
The Pakistani Government's treatment of women & girls is incredible according to Mr Kristof.
This year a doctor named Shazia Khalid reported she had been gang-raped in agovernment owned gas plant. Instead of treating her medically, officials drugged her unconscious for 3 days to keep[ her quiet & then shipped her to a psychiatric hospital.
When she persisted in trying to report the rape, she was held under house arrest in Karachi. The police suggest that since she had cash she must have been working as a prostitute. Shazia husband has stood by her, but his grandfather was quoted calling for her death.
ON AVERAGE, A WOMAN IS RAPED EVERY 2 HOURS IN PAKISTAN, & 2 WOMEN A DAY DIE IN HONOUR KILLINGS.
While Shazia & Mukhtaran have had international support, most victims in Pakitan are on their own. This yerar, police report a village council punishing a man by ordering his 2-year-old niece be given in marriage to a 40-year-old man....
If this kind of Feudal treatment of women doesn't raise consciousness I don't know what will.
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Post by bryan on Jun 24, 2005 6:13:33 GMT
The result of the elections in GALICIA in North West Spain is the the right-wing Partido Popular (PP) has lost its overall majority and will probably be able to form a regional government.
The PP got 37 seats in the new parliament. The socialist PSdeG got 25 & the nationalist BNG got 13. We will have to wait while next Monday to know if the socialists & nationalists will form a government. If so, it will be the first time the nationalists of Galicia have participated in the government. Both the PSdeG & BNP have broadly feminist positions (I think the national socialist government in Madrid has just past a law on men doing their share of the house-work & their law on Gay marriage goes further than the Dutch law).
The PP, on the other hand is very traditionalist: for the traditional family; against gay-marriage & feminism; and for a united Spain. Many of the members of PP come from a Francoist background. This party still has considerable support in the country, but since the bombings by the islamisists on March 11th, 2004, the country has been divided as at no time since the Civil War.
A
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Post by BRAN on Jun 24, 2005 6:43:37 GMT
I reported above that "the the right-wing Partido Popular (PP) has lost its overall majority and will probably be able to form a regional government." This ought to have been: 'the right-wing Partido Popular has lost its overall majority & will PROBABLY NOT BE ABLE TO FORM A REGIONAL GOVERNMENT.'
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Post by Mitch on Jun 24, 2005 9:50:26 GMT
PAKISTAN'S VICTIMS. Next month, Pakistan's Prime Minister, Pervez Musharraf, visits George Bush in Washington. Nicholas Kristof, in the International Herald Tribune, suggests Bush should call for the return of Mukhtaran Bibi's passport. Ms Bibi is a rape victim turned human-rights campaigner in Pakistan. A few days ago Musharraf was battered with queries about why he persecuted rape victims & had to cancel interviews, when he visited New Zealand. The Pakistani Government's treatment of women & girls is incredible according to Mr Kristof. This year a doctor named Shazia Khalid reported she had been gang-raped in agovernment owned gas plant. Instead of treating her medically, officials drugged her unconscious for 3 days to keep[ her quiet & then shipped her to a psychiatric hospital. When she persisted in trying to report the rape, she was held under house arrest in Karachi. The police suggest that since she had cash she must have been working as a prostitute. Shazia husband has stood by her, but his grandfather was quoted calling for her death. ON AVERAGE, A WOMAN IS RAPED EVERY 2 HOURS IN PAKISTAN, & 2 WOMEN A DAY DIE IN HONOUR KILLINGS. While Shazia & Mukhtaran have had international support, most victims in Pakitan are on their own. This yerar, police report a village council punishing a man by ordering his 2-year-old niece be given in marriage to a 40-year-old man.... If this kind of Feudal treatment of women doesn't raise consciousness I don't know what will. Point taken of course, and I read all your posts in here, mostly with great interest. It's just when you start rolling off the point, urr onto individual indulgences!! I welcome the information you're bringing from Spain and Pakistan. I could tell you a few horrific stories about working class women round these 'ere parts as well. I make a lot of visits during the week to many of my working class women friends, and all have stories to tell not just about abuse in relationships with men, but abuses by the State as regards benefits, and how neighbours turn their noses up at any woman who is different in some way. But we are a feisty lot, and coming together makes us stronger!
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Post by michele cryer on Jun 24, 2005 9:50:42 GMT
Bryan, thanks for posting more of the articles above.
I agree that these things that are happening are atrocious, and just wonder in what way we could play a part in changing the situation in those countries? I feel quite helpless to assist them at this point...what would you suggest?
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Post by Mitch on Jun 24, 2005 9:59:44 GMT
Hey Michele, I think what us women do on a local level, helping each other has great value, and we are doing this already. We have stories and experiences too. International connections between women and women's experiences are pretty poor at the moment. The women's movement in the 1970s started with small groups of women in their own local environment coming together to help each other (often connecting with local anarchist groups, like with the Burnley Voice), and making connections about their own oppression. That's where it starts, who know where it will lead in terms of international connections and helping each other. I think this is a useful link on how to help: www.rawa.org/help.htmfrom Revolutionary Association of the Women of Afghanistan (RAWA)
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Post by michele cryer on Jun 24, 2005 10:04:26 GMT
Thanks Mitch....
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Post by bryan on Jun 27, 2005 6:17:42 GMT
Michele writes about the rape victims etc in Pakistan: "I agree that these things that are happening are atrocious, and just wonder in what way we could play a part in changing the situation in those countries? I feel quite helpless to assist them at this point...what would you suggest?"
What would I suggest? Well perhaps Bush & Blair shouldn't be playing footsie with Pakistan's President Musharraf. Or at least they should be pressurising him to do something about the monsterous situtuation in his country. It would be interesting to know what is the position of George Galloway & Respect on this matter. Their party seeks to appeal to the Muslim voters in this country, & has the Muslim Association of Britain (MAB) as one of its sponsers. I understand the MAB membership is mostly Middle Eastern & not Pakistani, but it would still be interesting to know how they stand on this issue.
As I write, the world news on radio 4 is reporting on a case of a village council in Pakistan, which some time ago ordered the gang-rape of a girl as punishment for something another member of her family had done.
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Post by michele cryer on Jun 28, 2005 1:31:23 GMT
I agree with your ideas about what ought to be done Bryan, and yes, it would be interesting to see Respect's point of view about these matters...the last piece of news you report is very distressing.
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Post by bryan on Jun 30, 2005 6:42:01 GMT
Mitch writes: 'I could tell you a few horrific stories about working class women round these 'ere parts as well. I make a lot of visits during the week to many of my working class women friends, and all have stories to tell not just about abuse in relationships with men, but abuses by the State as regards benefits, and how neighbours turn their noses up at any woman who is different in some way.'
Mitch is absolutely right; we don't have to go to the other side of the world to discover all sorts of things. Ludwig Wittgenstein urged us all to dig our own back gardens saying 'you won't have to dig very deep to discover something of interest'.
This is the beauty of BURNLEY VOICE & I hope Northern Voices. It is just that sometimes we can pick an idea or two about what's going on in some other unlikely places, which may just shed a bit of light on our local problems.
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Post by michele cryer on Jun 30, 2005 7:16:27 GMT
You're both absolutely correct Bryan!
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